cross-posted from: https://lemmy.zip/post/50351339
The ‘yankification’ of British politics continues with Turning Point drawing attention to whatever the hell these people are supposed to be
You know, if this was a Muslim group, this would be front page news and a moral panic, and there would be debates on if we should ban this group.
UK moment. If this was a Muslim group, they would have been hauled off for “terrorism” well before the story hit the press.
Not sure we can win this war. The USA, Britain, Russia, Hungary, Israel, Possibly China and Germany AGAIN, vs the rest of the world. If this happens, the human race is finished!
I just want to live on the bottom of the ocean right now, I want out of this shitty “civilization”, have not experienced much good from it.
You never win the wars you don’t fight.
You think these idiots are going to turn into some kind of international fascist union? Most of them ran on the platform of “fuck literally everyone else, we hate those guys”
Everyone already hates the USA after 9 months of fascist leadership. The USA and EU are in an active proxy war with Russia and China is helping on the Russian side. Israel is burning through all of the support they have acquired over the last decades. Brexit was almost a decade ago now.
We’re spending so much time fearing fascists we’re forgetting why we actually fear them: they’re adversarial, they suck ass at governing, and they fuck up constantly. Relations have never been worse between these countries since this right wing tide, and though there’s a lot of financial support for these parties, their international political unity extends as far as before they have a small disagreement.
Brexit isn‘t really relevant to the UK. ATM Reform, the most far-right party, is polling very well. As in „would become the ruling party if an election were called today“ well. They‘re also starting to get defectors from the hertofore bigger right-wing party (whose leader literally just said at the party conference that the UK should have it‘s own ICE squads doing what the US one is).
Some of the fearmongering is overwrought - especially the characterisation of Labour as being equivalent because they are acting in some utterly reprehesible ways in a stupid and doomed effort to court Reform voters - but it‘s a threat that should be taken seriously.
The good news is that the next election is 4 years away. If Trump fails in that time, or if the US gets so unahamdedly fascist that even the most denialist person can‘t deny it and it seriously harms the US on the international stage, then perhaps the British right-wing politicians will fall out of love with trying to ape Trump and the punters will see the warning signs and quietly shift back leftwards (or will crawl back in their holes in an atmosphere of „actually it isn‘t okay to say that out loud“).
I think also we‘ll need the Your party to definitively collapse so as not to split the vote on the left and for Starmer himself to resign and someone like Andy Burnham to take over (although he‘s just flubbed that one) in order to make Labour electable again.
Or there‘s the other option of Labour actually introducing something like proportional representation before the next election and thereby limiting the power of a party like Reform.
Point is, there are ways out of this mess, and there‘s time for it to happen. And we‘re definitely not where the US is, and the idea of a NeoNazi coalition seems far-fetched even under a potential Farage leadership. But at the same time, there is definitely cause for serious concern here in the UK, because there are definitely those in power or near power who would very much like to be where Trump is now.
I mean the us is pretty facist at this point. We have unmarked paramilitary police. The dudes with flak jackest, ar15 type rifles, and bandanas over their faces that is like the hallmark of every effed up place on earth for decades. They are regularly breaking two of the more key bill of rights, due process and involuntary search and seizure, with no repercussions and that is besides the straight out murders the have committed. People are being carted off to foreign gulags. They are bragging about facilities being built to be cruel and unusual (yet another bill of rights violation). And military from some states are invading other states. I mean the facist has not consolidated power completely but man.
Yes, i was explaining why the same isn’t true in the UK, but that that also doesn’t mean that we can just sit back and relax like it isn’t a possibility down the road
That’s some interesting insight. I don’t really know how Brexit has affected the UK, I was just using it as an example of the breakdown of international unity. Maybe that’s not very applicable, though.
You think these idiots are going to turn into some kind of international fascist union? Most of them ran on the platform of “fuck literally everyone else, we hate those guys”
Fascists will turn on each other eventually when a common enemy is gone. For them, it’s always a competition to the top.
They’re doing it before the common enemy is gone, even.
I very much feel this.
I feel this too. I don’t know where to go or why anyone would turn to fascism ever
It’s because we hit peak capitalism.
Things aren’t getting better, they’re getting worse. And so all these billionaire fucks are trying to keep the population in line because they know their control is slipping
The only reason people are turning fascist is because we let billionaires control the flow of information, and they carefully tweaked a formula that can convert a small segment of the population into foaming at the mouth Nazis, and they amplify them to hack our sense of group consensus
Wiser generations knew that allowing people to become this wealthy was dangerous.
I mean, this has been happening since Rome. This same pattern happens over and over, the empire rises, spreads, there’s a golden age, and the golden age ends when a small group ends up with too much of the pie. Then it all crashes down and we have a dark age
We have so many stories about the danger of it because it keeps happening. We really need to break the cycle, I don’t think our species can survive another empire
The differemce now is that the empires can completely destroy the world and make it unlivable if truly stupid people become leaders
No war but class war
Yeah uh, so desperate, that I’m like cloning my brain with a scanner if computers ever get advanced enough, and just uploading it to let it do whatever it has to do.
The USA and one of China/Russia alone could destroy the world. The USA already ravaged Latin and South America, and the Middle East; and the combined military-industry power of either pair would easily be able to occupy most other nations simultaneously. Britain, Hungary, Israel and Germany are just along for the ride. Those four are as meaningless in the international scene as every other nation that may stand against the Fascists. USA/China/Russia are the three powerhouses.
This is Russia and China’s cold war, won. They convinced the United States to join them in international terrorism, and no one ever came close to the power of that trifecta. The United Nations has no army. The European Union’s Defense Forces is the closest thing the free world has to a resistance. I’m typing this but only partially registering how fucked we are. The USA, for all it’s horrible acts, had the “defender of democracy” title for a reason – because the Free World depended on the perception that the USA would go to war to stop China and Russia attempting world domination. As faith in the USA drops, and these fascist alliances grow, I see no reason to believe there’s ever going to be a comeback. If anything, I foresee more nations embracing the USA-China-Russia team to preserve some of their existence – not that it’s excusable.
We had the internet. We had free travel. We were making strides in medicine and technology. And How did we lose? Because corporations run the USA, and the USA ran the Free World. Corpos would kill 7 billion people if they had reason to believe the reward of profit outweighed the risk of financial hardship. Fascism is the natural evolution of a corporate state.
USAmerica wanted a President that ran the country like a business; and we got what we asked for. Promises made; Promises kept.
Ahem, Russia was also supposed to win in 3 days, failed unexpectedly, and now Ukraine is sort of a superpower. EU is on the rise in arms, industry, and will. Maybe if we help Ukraine win, we can just Gangbang USA?
Ukraine’s victory was enabled in large part by the financial support of the United States, which for most of the war, was run by the Democrats. As much as I’d like it, a “gangbang” of the USA is also impractical, given that the USA has many nuclear weapons, both in the country, and abroad. The USA also has military bases across the world.
Ukraine had to hold out without support at first, then USA cut them off and Europe took over. They are still fighting back. Ukraine is one major threat to everyone, and they can teach the rest of the EU, and supply them with weapons after the war.
Remember in Terminator 2 when they destroyed Cyberdyne and stopped Judgment Day, only to find out in T3 that it still happens but it was pushed off to later? Ever feel like when Biden won, that was T2, and now we’re watching judgment day unfold in real-time anyway? The war is inevitable because it’s our nature.
Biden won, that was T2,
you mean ice cream, jack, wasn’t enough to keep that shit locked up?
Trump was meant to send the DNC a message in '16, and the fucked it all the way up. Bernie was right fucking there. Nah, let’s try hillary, or biden. Fuck doing the right thing with bernie.
This is why the ancient empires fell, now amplified by modern globalized technology at the worst possible time in regards to global disasters on a countdown. I hope they rot in their bunkers when all is finished. The irony is that no matter how self-sustaining they build them, they don’t seem to realize that they are bringing the most destructive aspect into them - themselves.
I hope they rot in their bunkers when all is finished.
Finding the air vents and filling them with concrete can expedite that process.
It’s very interesting how quickly narratives can be built. I’ve been exposed to TPUSA talking points for a full decade now and it’s completely obvious Charlie Kirk was not seeking any kind of truth sincerely.
That is the difference between rhetoric and philosophy. He only wanted to win.
Now we all just have to pretend like Kirk wasn’t peddling ideologies that dearly want to silence those who disagree with them. Free speech evangelist my ass.
Being pro free speech has nothing to do with willingness to change your opinion. Rhetoric and philosophy are both contained within the free speech bubble. Also there are no ideologies that are free from the potential of stifling others free speech, which is why it needs to be vigorously protected by everyone, all the time.
He was pro-free-speech in the same way as a rapist is pro-free-sex.
Didn’t TPUK push Hitler did nothing wrong? Yaaaaaa. I remember Klandyce making that comment with Charlie on stage with her.
It’s bad enough dealing with this hyper hatred in the US. When hate groups spread to other countries, it should be labeled as an international terrorist group.
When I hear about maga stuff in canada and australia and now uk. wow. just wow.
The tentacles trace to Moscow
May they all follow in Charlie’s footsteps.
I’m literally hearing Catholic faith ministers in Europe on the radio speak about Charlie Kirk as if he was some sort of religious icon, when normally they wouldn’t care less about local pop culture figures in other countries who weren’t even Catholic.
I suspect that whatever succeeded Cambridge Analytica and is getting financed by the oligarchs now toppling the US government has now also moved on from just targeting influencers online to more traditional influencers that will freely spread their whitewashed portrayal on their mediums. They sort of have to do this because, like Russia discovered as they began their war with Ukraine and Trump did when COVID happened during his first term, their foreign propaganda breaks apart when they have been artificially imposed on local talking with very different perspectives - they have to normalize the talking points on those most vulnerable yet most influential so that they are all brainwashed in generally the same way and spread the same emotionally based drivel filled with half truths and outright lies.
Those conservative Catholics are turkeys voting for Christmas. As soon as Kirk’s coreligionists fully seize power, Catholics would be rounded up.
Can they just skip to the step where they start eating each other and leave the rest of us alone?
Nope. You’re gonna have to kill em.
Calling for violence based on a lie…
Oh sweet, I can tell blackshirts to fuck off at home now
The grift must feed.
Call 1-800-LUFT-WAFFE…this time, we are the good guys. The sad part, I could see the fucking losers gaining ground with the MAGAts.
Can we ban turning point UK and all other American social media platforms for that matter.
Although what they did in soho does seem pretty based, but yanks out
Just looked into king’s army, they’re not blackshirts at all. Still wary about their affiliations with TPUSA, though
Seems like this article is biased and doesn’t even know what it’s talking about. Isn’t this basically a new take on the Salvation Army? Not my cup of tea, really, but this article is quite conspiratorial
Digging deeper, “the canary” is just taking stuff out of context.
King’s Army soldiers believe we are at war with sin and the devil. We see life like a battlefield that is split down the middle, with two opposing armies on each side.
On one half of the battlefield (life/light) (Col 1:12) are The King’s soldiers (Christians). (2 Tim 2:3)
On the other half of the battlefield (death/darkness) (Col 1:13), are Satans soldiers (Demons)
Behind enemy lines, trapped in trenches, deep in darkness, and sinking in swamps of sin, are the casualties of war. They are the dead (spiritually), or dying lost souls. (1 Pet 2:9)
These are children of The King (2 Cor 6:18) who were deceived, and drawn away by their own selfish desires (James1:14).
They are devoid of escape from the snares of the devil, having being captured by him to do his will. (2 Tim 2:26)
Hidden here are legions of sons and daughters blinded to the truth. (2 Cor 4:4)
Their hearts have been poisoned by a terminal virus called sin, for which there is no earthly cure. (Jer 17:9)
There is however, a heavenly antidote. This antidote is hidden in the form of a bullet, a salvation bullet, containing one drop of God’s Holy blood.
When fired from the weapon of the Gospel (2 Cor 6:7), the bullet finds its target (black heart) and there the salvation serum is released. It swims into the blood stream, reversing the terminal death process and bringing life everlasting. (1 Pet 2:9).
We believe the mission given from the King to all of his soldiers, is to take back that which was stolen! (Matt 28:19) (Col 1:13)
There is NOTHING here promoting actual violence. Still a bit weird, but the canary is also promoting the fearmongering conspiracy theories which also caused someone to murder Charlie Kirk in the first place
Context: Flax likes the idea of blackshirts because he agrees with them, so he pretends all that deliberately violent imagery that literally demonizes their “opponents” is nothing to worry about and definitely not bog standard cryptofash shit.
oh woah, another day, another strawman. Why am I not surprised.
If you knew theology and terminology, you’d know that these are definitely not literal calls to violence. It’s like calling the hymn “Jerusalem the Golden” zionist.
This comes across as a holiness group. The same source of the Salvation Army. They even say on their website they have no interest in politics.
It seems like it’s more inspired by the Salvation Army than blackshirts.
Instead of wasting your time on some hyperactive holiness Christians, why not focus your energy on actual dangerous groups like Reform UK???
These are a dangerous group. They are a direct action homophobic and transphobic group that used intimidation tactics.
If you ran into them in real life you would understand. They were out in Soho which is famous for being an LGBT hub harassing people for “sexual deviancy” telling people they were going to hell and needed to be “saved”
And fighting this group does not mean we can’t fight other groups as well. Claiming we can’t is a classic right wing technique to try and detract from left wing resistance efforts in order to normalise people like this.
Edit: from his comments this guy is saying this shit because he’s a Christianband agrees with these people pushing their beliefs on people and harassing them.
They were out in Soho which is famous for being an LGBT hub harassing people for “sexual deviancy” telling people they were going to hell and needed to be “saved”
That doesn’t sound like violent intimidation tactics. It might cause offence, yes, but a mixed group of unarmed men and women of different ages from various races chanting “Jesus Saves” in a street is hardly terrorism- it sounds more like a peaceful protest if anything (albeit, extremely unorthodox and counter productive. But again, this is within the character of charismatic movements). That doesn’t change even if you think they’re nutjobs/disagree with them. In fact, it’s quite a refreshing change from that march in London a number of weeks ago. Street preachers aren’t anything new in the UK. People probably wouldn’t have even noticed if Turning Point hadn’t used a video of them for content, and the Canary just wanted something to fearmonger over.
Soho is also famous for being a nightclub hub in general. I don’t know the area though so I cannot tell if they’re particularly targeting a gay bar or not.
However, seeing people call for violence or calling people terrorist over speculation is deeply disturbing.
So you are seriously telling me that you genuinely believe that an organised group calling themselves an army, showing up to a queer space as a mob to shout at them that they are going to hell, isn’t intimidation tactics?
Then you guys wonder why people hate Christians in general.
They are shouting “Jesus Saves” in a street. If you can show me that’s a queer space and they were also shouting at people telling them they were going to hell, please do.
They described the area as a “sex district.” I don’t think that homosexuality was all that they cared about.
Edit: Did a bit of digging.
So they’re chanting it (don’t even know if this can be called protesting) outside Ann Summers (a sex toy shop) in Old Compton Street, Soho, London. There are also bars nearby, an amount of them gay.
That’s all I can find so far. Still don’t see where the violent intimidation comes into play, even if it’s not my cup of tea.
Why talk about the thugs of the SA when the Nazi Party itself exists!!!
The SA was a paramilitary that had a party - the Nazi Party.
What party does the King’s Army - notably not a paramilitary - answer to?
Exactly.
Every morning, in schools across the world, children assemble in uniforms in an orderly fashion. Are you going to call them the SA as well?
Because that’s literally the only thing here that they have in comparison with the SA- Assembling in large groups in uniforms.
I realize that if you could create an intellectually honest argument you wouldn’t be a conservative but just lmao
Looks like a militant terrorist organisation to me, should be arresting them
What? No they’re right wing, so those weapons and drills and marching are festive.
It looks like that but they seem to be basically just modern Salvation Army copycats, especially from looking at their website
I think we’re better focusing on reform UK and the racist marches than a bunch of hyperactive holiness Christians
Turning Point is a youth propaganda machine fuelled by pseudoreligious arseholes. These people demonstrably only care about themselves and how much money they can make. It’s spread to the UK is deeply concerning.
I cannot find evidence that this group has anything to do with turning point except for being featured on their Twitter once.
When you start looking at the “leadership” they are all either non-existent online or tied to a number of dodgy evangelical churches, there’s no obvious detail of who is funding any of them, it looks like Noone has previously researched it in detail. But the few tied to that McNamara guy looks like authoritarian nutjob dog whistles.
Having a look into them now. It’s interesting how one of the images shows the Ulster Banner for Northern Ireland despite it being part of the UK and NcNamara being from Northern Ireland and having a Union Jack.
Interestingly on his Instagram, there is a post promoting a Roman Catholic Church which is uncommon for Northern Irish protestants to do.
He does follow TPUK and that’s it and kind of scraping the bottom of the barrel.
I will say though, groups like TPUK could potentially be trying to groom groups like these. Although they have a commitment on their website to be apolitical so I don’t think it’s much
You cannot find other people online simply because this seems like a small group. Possibly a bit of larp in there, but I think the Canary is literally just building them up to seem like murderous extremists for clicks/fearmongering. I don’t find the canary to be a reliable news source anyway.
It’s only a militant terrorist organization if it contains leftists or minorities, otherwise it’s just sparkling free speech /s
or grannies
They have minorities and grannies… Look at the picture…
Not for nothing but they don’t have free speech in Europe
You’ve been listening to American propaganda again. “Free speech” isn’t an absolute binary in any country in the world, including the US.
I didn’t say anything about America, I’m just pointing out that Europe absolutely and demonstrably does not have free speech protections.
In context of the times, Jesus was very left. Surprised they didn’t kill the guy.
But they uh… ah…
Shh, no spoilers. He obviously hasn’t gotten to that part yet.
he skipped the middle
They don’t support Palestine so it’s ok. Duh.
