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- world@lemmy.world
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The United States should ban cigarettes, but should continue to allow tobacco to be used in smoke-free forms.
If you want to poison yourself, that should be your choice, but poisoning others should not be allowed.
In countries with solidary health insurance expenses to cover unnecessary, tobacco related cancers are paid by the whole population.
That happens in the US too. We just also pay CEO salaries and shareholder disbursements.
We’re such a generous nation ❤️
/s
And health care for Israel
And Iran. Think of how much healthcare we’re saving them by helping school kids never needs care again. /s, dark /s
Wait, that happens just about everywhere else too, I feel like it may just be a systematic problem
Taxes on tobacco don’t even begin to cover costs.
If we go that way, IMO smokers should pay higher health insurance contributions.
When I was playing full contact, injury rich sport, our club paid an additional insurance covering sport injuries for every game day - because general insurance can be stringent in such cases.
So, risky behavior = higher cost of insurance.
For context, I pay about 16% of my income towards health insurance. When I was between jobs, government paid most of it. I’m also a smoker, clearly realizing that this is a morbid self destructive habit.
That’s kind of shallow IMO. People drink and smoke (unhealthy much) usually because of something, like problems and such. We were also basically given cigarettes to start smoking and alcohol is everywhere, not always so simple. People don’t do it to spite taxpayers.
But it’s good, a really good trend, banning cigarettes, NZ started it IIRC.
Because every throat and lung cancer is caused by tobacco, we should make everyone who gets them go bankrupt and die? I’m really confused dude. What cancers are necessary.
s/unnecessary/avoidable/
Oh, so my initial assumption was correct, it’s whichever ones you personally feel like blaming the patient for getting. I take it the worst thing that’s ever happens to you is stubbing your toe and you’re a trust attorney?
smoker detected lol
No, my nephew had cancer when he was six months. Anyone who is rooting for cancer deserves to die of it.
Do you mind showing me where I was rooting for cancer?
You’re so dumb it’s funny.
The United States should ban cigarettes
Never read about the Prohibition?
Prohibition was unpopular. Smoking bans are popular. So it’s not a very good analogy.
Prohibition was ridiculously popular until it wasn’t. Just like smoking bans will be.
People will choose to smoke just because it’s illegal, and it will unironically be a gateway to harder drugs since the same guy selling tobacco will now be the same guy selling crack.
Prohibition was ridiculously popular until it wasn’t.
It failed because of widespread lawbreaking, organized crime, enforcement failures, and economic pressure (tax and jobs during the great depression)
Smoking is already on the decline, i don’t think you’ll find such fervor for cigarette running.
Smoking is already on the decline, i don’t think you’ll find such fervor for cigarette running
You’re wrong, it will also have widespread lawbreaking, enforcement failures, economic pressure, and create a new organized crime powerhouse. As always.
The smoking market is comparable to the drug market in size of users… how’s that drug war doing?
You’re wrong!
see how easy that is?
i don’t think you’ll find such fervor for cigarette running.
There is, in some countries with very high taxes on tobacco.
It’s a good analogy, because nicotine is a drug and smokers as addicts will seek it out whether or not it’s illegal.
A non-addictive drug like THC is a good comparison, as the legalization within the US is a big source of tax revenue and the period when it was more illegal made it a staple of cartels, which smuggled it into the states.
When criminals run an enterprise, they inevitably use their resources to undermine government and commit more crime. That’s the true nature of prohibition.
Prohibition of any item, meaning, making the item illegal to make or possess anywhere, is a stronger infringement on personal freedom and often leads to organized crime stepping in to provide the prohibited item, both of which make it unpopular.
Popular smoking bans generally ban smoking in certain public areas. This does not promote organized crime to sell the banned product, and is less of an infringement on personal freedom.
The proposal to “ban cigarettes” sounds like it would fall under the former category .
Yep.
Prohibition does not prevent. Prohibition makes the good things bad and the bad things worse.
“Controlled substance” they say. How Orwellian. Handing it over to the black market, with no control but [criminal] market forces. How controlled.
“We said don’t do it.”, like that works. Generally, good people do not obey bad rules, and bad people do not obey rules either.
Then there’s the forbidden fruit effect. Then the profiteering and price-hike for risk, and in absence of regulation oft coming in the most harmful polluted forms of whatever’s been turned into contraband. Dangerous combination.
Normalisation of controlling people’s behaviour’s an even deeper bag of rant bait yet, than just via banning substances, slippery sloping via banning delivery methods.
Funny how prohibition and “public relations” [e.g. as per Ed Bernay’s Crystallising Public Opinion] came into being at around the same time. Prohibition wouldn’t work without the accompanying psyop? Due reconsideration of the popularity of bans. … Especially in light of realising “Prohibition does not prevent. Prohibition makes the good things bad and the bad things worse.”
No one ever got cancer standing beside a drinker.
Drinkers kill people every day, drunk driving, drunken murders and violence, etc., all would not happen without alcohol.
They kill many more people than second-hand smoke, DUIs alone.
12000 drunk driving deaths vs estimated 34000 deaths from second-hand smoke in the USA.
You can easily search for these numbers given by official government sources.
This is exactly what I am thinking. A person can smoke legally, expelling drug laced smoke at everyone around them … including babies. However, if a person cannistered this up and went around spraying it that would likely be considered assault.
Same for drivers of ICE cars presumably?
Not a terrible idea but
The problem here is thinking the U.S. government exists to make intelligent decisions that will help us
Should they ban smoking weed too?
The United States should ban cigarettes
Go ahead, do it! You can call it the “Smoke War” and kill hundreds of thousands of additional people over the years (over and above the danger of smoking), imprison many times more, and destroy families from coast to coast!
BRILLIANT
A gas powered car with its exhaust fumes poisons others way more than a smoker. Same rules apply?
They should. A big part of the world is moving towards that, while the US moves backwards.
Completely agree
Yeah as the article notes people have switched to nicotine pouches to get their fix. Which are better because they don’t produce smoke and lung cancer, but they can still give you other oral cancers and dental diseases. If anything they’re probably worse in that aspect due to being constantly pressed against the gums and lips. But at least they’re smokeless.
More research is needed. Nicotine on its own is not cancerous. Tobacco is. Nicotine pouches that aren’t tobacco might carry much lower risks, but there is other stuff in them.
The only known negatives with nicotine is that it’s apparently a bit stressful for the heart. So it’s still good to avoid taking it, but if you’re going to take nicotine anyways, it’s the safest delivery method.
Do other countries also have an ingredients list on nicotine pouches? Sweden has always had it (even on snus), as it’s classified as a food product. I’ve always found it interesting that a product that shouldn’t be swallowed has an ingredients list, but products that “should” be swallowed (such as alcohol) doesn’t.
It’s the whole coronary system not just the heart. It also comes with the same swath of possible symptoms as most stimulants including high blood pressure, stress/anxiety, etc.
That said, IMO the biggest issue is the litter. Used pouches should go into the trash can and away from animals.
I don’t think the US has strict regulations on the ingredients… I don’t know why, likely lobbyist behavior, but also I think people just accept that if you smoke you don’t give a shit and it’s unhealthy by default, so it’s not a big deal if they add chemicals.
Which becomes more ridiculous with nicotine pouches for this reason. Nicotine isn’t cancerous, so it would be super shitty to add carcinogens in the pouches and then claim it’s a tobacco product so you should expect it.
I don’t think the US has strict regulations on the ingredients… I don’t know why
Unca Jesse. This cunt protected tobacco his entire sad life until he died of “natural causes”.
it’s the safest delivery method.
hitting your head with a 2 pound hammer is safer than hitting your head with a 10 pound hammer.
Vaping is very possibly much less unhealthy than chewing tobacco, but of course we don’t have long term studies yet
Nicotine pouches isn’t chewing tobacco. Chewing tobacco is one of the most unhealthiest ways to consume nicotine.
well you are putting it in your mouth, so you’re effectively swallowing parts of it.
Nicotine on its own is not cancerous.
Man… if you really want misinformation, read Lemmy on the subject of vapes and nicotine. Everyone just copy pastas incorrect “facts”.
and
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At least with vaping you can taper off the nicotine.
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I mixed my own liquid so I was able to go down to 4, 3, 2, 1, then 0.75, 0.5, down to like 0.25 and lower I think
I was such a fiend that lowering the nicotine meant I would just hit it harder and more often for longer lol but once you get sub 1mg you literally cant hit it fast enough to feel satisfied even if you spend hours chain vaping 🤣
I also had a RDA that put out massive clouds though so that didnt help with moderation lol
But kids are going 6>8>12mg.
Not to mention the littering problem is even worse than with cigarette butts.
it’s somewhat nice to not risk fires breaking out, though.
They are just in different places though. All the lithium batteries keep causing fires in bin lorries and recycling/waste processing places
Are they not biodegradable? The claim is that cigarette filters can’t be biodegradable (or no one forced them to), but why wouldn’t these be?
Not that it’s an excuse for littering, but we ought to be able to mitigate the harm a bit
Are they not biodegradable?
Doesn’t matter too much for the small woodland creature that comes behind you and tries to eat it, giving himself nicotine poisoning in the process.
Well, the pouches do not produce smoke is a plus, but it’s disgusting. They spit them out during meetings to replace immediately with a new. They are in wastbaskets, on the street. Gross. For what i understood from dentist & doctors (standard question: do you drink, smoke, snuss) it’s much worse than smoking. For the user that is, not their environment
It is actually basic and contains xylitol which is good for oral health. No link has been found to oral cancer. I don’t understand where you get those facts from?
No link has been found to oral cancer.
Stop listening to Tucker Carlson
“Xylitol’s Health Benefits beyond Dental Health: A Comprehensive Review”
“All authors are employees of DuPont Nutrition & Biosciences. DuPont Nutrition & Biosciences manufactures and markets xylitol. The authors declare no other conflict of interest.”
Tucker is a baby. Wtf are you talking about with xylitol? And I don’t understand how the “link” does not show any statistics, people have used it for hundreds of years very good amounts in my country. They just fuck up their gums
People just need to rediscover pipes. Tolkien knew what was up 👍
I love my pipe. Much more enjoyable experience.
I haven’t smoked in a long time, but I used to love my pipe. It’s been getting more and more tempting to try it again, since I have one of the few health issues where nicotine can sometimes help.
I know nothing of pipes other than shape. What is the functional advantages to it?
I think it’s “smoother” but I’ve never smoked one so I cannot confirm
In my very subjective opinion they taste better and are more fun.
The longer the stem is (the piece between the bowl and your mouth), the more time the smoke has to cool down before it hits your mouth, and some believe this gives a better smoking experience.
Some pipes also use filters, with don’t so much for chilling but remove some of the moisture from the smoke if you live in a humid area.
Longer stems also look badass
The big advantage is you can fill a pipe with whatever you want. Smoke shops at least used to have a large selection of smells and styles - think like a modern coffee aisle
Maybe that functional space is taken over by vapes these days
The parallels between coffee (or tea!) and pipe tobacco are strong. Different leaves, preparations, (non-)aromatics, etc.
Vapes - for me, at least - or closer to energy drinks. Different vibes for different tribes.
They can be made from different materials. Common ones are briar, olive, or fruit trees, but also clay or corn cob… Basically anything hard enough to withstand the burning leaf and low in tannins, which are harmful to smoke.
The shapes (and finishes) are mostly about look and feel, but as another commenter mentioned, the stem length affects temperature. Hot smoke (like a hot drink) results in tongue bite, but puffing gently and not smoking like 10 bowls back-to-back makes it easier to avoid.
There’s also a wide variety of different leaves, preparation methods, and toppings to explore, and their properties can change depending how you store / treat them. The different materials influence the flavor a bit, too. Most pipe smokers have multiple pipes and rotate them to avoid mixing aromatics with non-aromatics or latakia (la-TAK-ia).
It’s not expensive or difficult to try. If you know anyone who’s interested, just find a cheap pipe (maybe something with 9mm filter), pick a tobacco that looks good, and watch a 5-minute video about how to pack and light the bowl. Then enjoy together with a good beverage. If it’s enjoyable, watch another video about cleaning the pipe, and take it from there.
Some people smoke multiple times a day, and others smoke less often. It’s not like pulling a cigarette out of the box, though, and the mild ‘inconvenience’ of packing and cleaning helps to not chain-smoke. I prefer the process, don’t mind waiting for a good thing… not in a hurry.
I’ve also read what I could find about health risks. Pipes are lower risk than cigarettes, hookahs, and smokeless tobacco (of which the loose variety is riskier than pouches). They’re a bit safer than cigars due to volume. Newer studies show vaping is also riskier than pipes, depending mostly on the liquid. Tobacco-free nicotine pouches seem to be the safest, but more research is needed. I’m not an authority, though, so #doYourOwnResearch, and definitely reply if you see any info that needs to be corrected in this comment.
Pipe smoke smell is way worse than cigarretes. Old prof used to smoke pipe in his office… Stench is worse than tobacco bars and cig smoking offices +20 years later.
My dad occasionally smoked a pipe. I do not remember the house or his clothes stinking from it (he probably didn’t smoke inside, I don’t remember) and to this day get warm feelings when smelling cherrywood smoke
Unlike cigarettes or pot, pipe smoke can be pleasant
Can’t say about wood smoke, but a cherry topped aromatic tobacco can be good 😊
or pot
Different strokes and all that.
Different tokes 😉
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Fantastic. About 75% of the people I know still smokes though. Paywall stops me from reading the article but I do wonder what the sample size is.
I’m pretty sure i got the whole article:
Sweden has reached its target of fewer than five percent of the population smoking regularly – and is consequently considered “smoke-free”.
“It is an incredible development that a harmful behaviour can be reduced to this extent,” Mats Ramstedt, head of research at the Swedish Council for Information on Alcohol and Other Drugs (CAN), told the TT news agency.
For the first time in CAN’s surveys, fewer than five percent smoke regularly in Sweden, according to the 2025 annual report on smoking and snus habits, which means that the political goal for Sweden to be smoke-free by 2025 has been achieved.
The proportion of daily smokers dropped from 16 to 4.8 percent between 2003 and 2025, according to the new report.
“It is not just the proportion of smokers that has decreased; we also see that people are smoking fewer cigarettes. Given the health risks associated with cigarette smoking, this is obviously very positive,” said Ramstedt.
Smoking has been declining in Sweden since the late 1970s (for comparison: in the early 1980s, over 30 percent of Swedes smoked daily), thanks to broad preventative work, according to Ramstedt.
“The first and perhaps most vital point is that accessibility has been drastically reduced. It is both harder and more expensive to smoke today,” said Ramstedt, citing taxes and real-term prices rising by 45 percent since 2003.
FROM THE LOCAL’S ARCHIVE: How Sweden is close to stubbing out smoking for good
He also credited efforts made to deter people from starting to smoke in the first place, such as advertising bans, and to make it easier for people to quit.
Meanwhile, Sweden has seen a sharp increase in the use of snus in recent years – the small nicotine pouches popular in Sweden – a factor that the tobacco industry often highlights as a major reason for Sweden’s low proportion of smokers.
“One must keep in mind that smoking had already decreased sharply before we saw this rise in snus. In a way, that argues against it being a decisive factor in reducing smoking,” said Ramstedt, but conceded that more research into its role could provide useful insights. “My assessment is that there is a lack of studies proving this, and I would maintain that it is primarily down to preventative measures.”
My country is fentanyl-free. Less than 5% of the population consumes it.
That said, congrats on Sweden.
Thank you. Looks like they ask 18 000 people at random yearly. Quite a good sample size for a country of 10 million citizens. But I’d take it with a scoop of salt as it’s self reported and other numbers are weirdly worded if not wrong. I recall cigarettes being 38 SEK for a pack in 2008. Now they’re 78 SEK, which is far more than +45% and in a shorter time span.
Edit: found the summary. 30% are still using nicotine, allegedly.
That inspired me to look up my own country’s rate of smoking over the years and I’m shocked that we’re over 10% still, and were at 20% in 09. I know everything used to stink of cigarettes all the time, but that still feels so high
If they follow the rest of the EU and start banning flavored snus in favor of only menthol flavors you can expect to see a sharp spike in cigarette usage again. It’s funny this study doesn’t mention vapes, which, anecdotally, are massively popular in Sweden.
It’s funny this study doesn’t mention vapes
Wanna know what’s even funnier? The study totally does.
Even in the us, where industry capture prevents meaningful restrictions, American Lung Association says
Long term, smoking rates … among adults, from 42.6% in 1965 to 11.6% in 2022.
We may never hit that “smoke free” threshold but there’s real progress
Kudos to Sweden for making it happen
using Reader Mode in Firefox does work.
Anecdotally i’d say it’s probably more like 10%, however i think at this point smoking is so unusual that you REALLY notice if even a single person does it near you, which inflates how high the usage feels.
They’re all ramming Snus against their gums like there’s no tomorrow though.
If True
Smokers who have taken up snus use have quit smoking to a significantly greater extent than smokers without snus use, and a substantial proportion has eventually quit snus use as well and become tobacco-free.
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC5129320/#sec6-ijerph-13-01110
Registrations dated from 1994 to 2023. All participating regions provided data from at least 2015 and forward. Overall prevalence for smoking was 12%, and 13% for snus.
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/14034948251350193
Doesn’t really seem to be true exactly. But, snus use is mildly more popular than smoking in Sweden.
I know theres nicotine pouch brands with up to 200mg per pouch. Idk how this person ended up in this state but i would guess they werent a regular nicotine user before.
I use nicotine pouches myself, not trying to defend it, its obviously bad. Compared to inhaling the giga cancer smoke from ciggarettes i do still believe it is better though. Although idk which crazy people go for the “end my life instantly” strengths.
‘Smoke free contry’
It’s about cigarettes
Bruh
But yet when the British government does this, Lemmites claim it’s an attack on personal freedom and fascism.
